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TOPIC: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser

Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 12:30 #17954

  • slapintheface
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so mad i had 2 typos........lol
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 15:39 #17955

  • NSCInemas
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And its not the first time you have been told that you have no clue what you are talking about. You got nasty with me first, read the thread sir. Owning ones own theatre is an issue of money not intelligence or experience. You have no idea what my experience, or position in this industry is. I do not own a theatre but I have put my time in as a G.M. of large 20 screen locations for a major chain, as well as being a 35mm and 70mm projection and sound technician and a Dolby labs certified sound technician. My current position has me working closely with the studios, that being how I know people that have been given release prints as gifts.

Yes, I get nasty when people state false information. Whats the big deal about that, you ask? Say someone inherited a legal 35mm print of a rare classic from a relative who died. After reading your statement this person lights a bonfire and destroys this print. Meanwhile, there is a fire or flood at the studios vault and the last print of this classic that was owned by the studio is destroyed. The studio has records that they gave a print to this person and track it down so that this masterpiece is available for future generations only to find out that it was destroyed because of what you posted.

Stating facts that are not true can be very dangerous. When someone does that then asks me "WHY DONT YOU GET IT NSCINEMAS" Yes then I get nasty.
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 15:48 #17956

  • JMovies
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I agree with NSCInemas. I am a lawyer for a major studio who has the dream of one day owning my own theatre. I dont post here much but this is twice ive seen NSCInemas attacked for looking out for people who may not know as much as others and take what is posted here as fact. I can tell Mr. Slap that he is 100% Absoultely wrong. There are cases in which we have sold prints to collectors for a price after they signed a contract stating that they do not own the license to show the print, and that they understand that unless they make arrangements with the studio to pay for the license they may not publicly exhibit the said print. Directors, are also routinely given prints of their films, as well as some producers, and other studio executives, It is a very common practice.

I think everyone needs to remember that people take what is posted here as accurate. When someone posts something that thy are not 100% sure of they are really doing a dis-service to everyone who reads these posts. I am glad that some people are willing to speak up and challenge those statements. Thank You!


Sorry, I just wanted to add that also if someone made a ccopy of a DVD onto 35mm print stock we would have no recourse as the laws pertaining to copyrights are very clear that the owner of a record, CD, or Video etc... are allowed to make a copy for their own personal use.


[This message has been edited by JMovies (edited March 20, 2008).]
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 15:51 #17957

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What is happening to these forums? They use to be fun and informative.
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 16:07 #17958

  • slapintheface
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i thought you were the one that got nasty with ROXY also????

any way.........i call a studio rep today and asked if i have a 35mm print is it legal ...He told me very clearly NOWAY!
People may have prints but in no way should they as there is no way for it to be legal.


So go play in a sandbox...........You guys are the ones telling people wrong info..
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 16:15 #17959

  • JMovies
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I do not know who you spoke to sir but this rep is clearly not a member of the bar and not qualified to issue that response. As I have stated very clearly your posting is innacurate. If you want to provide me your address I would be happy to send you a letter from my office on studio stationary stating the facts of this matter.
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 16:16 #17960

  • slapintheface
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usher
ast mgr
mgr
district manager
film buyer
projectionist
theater owner

That is just my theater EXPERIENCE.....
NOW we could add President of 2 Chamber of Commerce and owner of a chain of 18 retail locations..

So would be nice to here what your experience is.......
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 16:31 #17961

  • NSCInemas
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May I point you to this article on the website DVD Talk.Com http://www.dvdtalk.com/dvdsavant/s84collect.html

"But there are still plenty of 35mm collectors around. Savant's experience with them was in the 1970s when he directed screening series at the UCLA Film School. Typically, we'd rent a 16mm print of a film to get legal title to screen it, but then also rent a collector's perfect 35mm copy and screen that so it would look great on the big Melnitz screen. This worked fine until a night we showed Invasion of the Body Snatchers and North By Northwest. With the 35mm tech print of the Hitchcock film mounted onto house reels and ready to go, a notice on MGM stationery showed up taped to the screening room door, saying that marshalls were going to sieze the illegal print of the film. After a mad dash to hide the collector's film and get the 16mm replacement, with anxiety and paranoia to spare, the note turned out to be a practical joke from a fellow film student."

"A collector friend of mine who had a large number of early talkies and silents was very vocal about the legality of owning personal prints of studio movies. He showed me a brochure from Warner Brothers printed in the early '50s, selling prints of movies like Treasure of the Sierra Madre and Dr. Erlich's Magic Bullet, outright, to schools and churches. Apparently a collector had been on trial for having a Warner's film, which the Warner lawyers had argued was Warner property, because no prints had ever been legally sold into private possession. The defense's display of the contradictory brochure resulted in the case being thrown out of court. "

"big directors who were film collectors (Martin Scorsese is the main example that comes to mind) were routinely 'given' prints by studios or allowed to order prints at cost. "

"In the '70s, many studio executives maintained elaborate, sometimes palatial screening rooms in their Beverly Hills and Bel Air homes. A constantly circulating group of prints made the rounds. I projected at one time or another for Mike Frankovich and Barbara Streisand, and once for Barry White, whose deep, DEEP voice was no put-on! Frankovich must have been at the top of the screening pecking order because he and wife Binnie Barnes would always get the top titles. I first saw Taxi Driver there, and met Dino de Laurentiis when they screened The Shootist. Unfortunately, these royal types didn't have much desire to talk to lowly student projectionists. Each of these screening rooms seemed to have lots of prints lying around - Barry's favorite was the '33 King Kong, which I screened twice for him in one evening!"

"There are plenty of collectors today with rare items, many of them unique, precisely because of the studios' penchant for cleaning house. Lots of films are missing all kinds of elements, like stereo soundtracks, and roadshow version trims. It's A Mad Mad Mad World was reassembled on laserdisc in 1991 only because a former UA executive located a projectionist collector who had saved several reels' worth of 70mm roadshow trims. Rumor is that an original 70mm roadshow element for all or most of the film has been located, so maybe the holdup on a really REALLY restored Mad Mad World is possible again (die hard fans cite scenes missing from even the laserdisc restoration).

The '33 King Kong is another example of collectors saving film history, twice, as a matter of fact. In the '60s, a private collector came forward with a 16mm copy of the scenes censored from Kong and simply thrown away by RKO, soon after its original release. Then later, a 35mm print was found (in Argentina?) in which the scenes were preserved almost perfectly. Thankfully, before they were projected to death they got back to RKO or Turner or whoever and the present cut of Kong on TCM is a beautiful restoration. "

While this artice does state that the studios are very hostile to people who illegally posess these titles this article proves that studios have sold release prints and that they have given them to directors and executives in the past.

SLAP Where is your evidence to back up what you say????

I said it before and hopefully this time it this will be done.

I AM ALL DONE WITH THIS ISSUE.


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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 16:58 #17962

  • JMovies
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Bravo, NSC, Bravo!!! Maybe you should have been the lawyer, lol!

Slap, if you want to talk about experience I have never seen someone go from being a film buyer to being a projectionist??? That seems really odd. The only way I can think of for that to happen is to be let go from the film buying job and have to take a job as a projectionist to pay the bills but I don't really know your situation or what happened there. It just looks funny to me.

Me... I went to college at BU and went to law school at Harvard, thats how I know NSCInemas I worked for him at a theatre in Boston when I was in school. From there I moved to L.A. and passed the bar exam there. I have been with my current employer ever since, I started out doing research and am now one of the lead attorneys in the legal department.
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 17:00 #17963

  • slapintheface
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Your comment "Many of these prints were intially turned over to these dealers by studios getting rid of surplus material". Is not really that true. The studios do not sell 35mm prints to the public. Yes, prints do find there ways to the collectors market by someone taking the item. The MPPA will look into problems dealing with 35mm prints. If you look at some end credits from features there is a line that states That this print is not for sale and owned by the studio. I've had a few collectors have their 35mm collections taken by the MPPA and returned to the said studios.
posted by William on Oct 5, 2007 am31 8:36am
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 17:19 #17964

  • NSCInemas
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I posted a response but i am removing it because I feel I have proved SLAP wrong beyond a reasonable doubt, and I said that I was done with this topic.

Now back to your regularly scheduled program!

[This message has been edited by NSCInemas (edited March 20, 2008).]
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 17:35 #17965

  • slapintheface
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As i bought this theater to come out of retirement (age 40) .....

I will just laugh ........Those who dont own theaters telling us we are wrong..
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 17:46 #17966

  • slapintheface
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The owner of the copyright in a movie trailer has exclusive rights to
public performance. See 17 U.S.C. Section 106. This means that no,
you cannot lawfully display the work in your home UNLESS you also have
a license (permission) from the copyright owner. This is why movies
you rent from Blockbuster have a warning screen at the beginning that
says you only have a license to display it in your home for
noncommercial viewing. I know that, e.g., Best Buy is currently
giving away DVD's with the "HellBoy" trailer on it. Obvioulsy, the
studio (as the copyright owner) authorized the distribution of those
trailers and has granted to persons obtaining a copy of the DVD the
right to publicly perform it (display it at home). If, alternatively,
you download a trailer off the Internet using Kazaa from a file-sharer
who works at a studio and stole the trailer to upload it and share it,
then no, you do not have a license to display it at home.

It is difficult to know if a copy you are purchasing was lawfully
obtained and thus is subject to the first sale doctrine. Do studios
generally sell copies of trailers? I can find no clearly endorsed
sources of studio trailers where it is stated that these are being
sold by the studio or their authorized agent. Most trailers are just
given away (like the HellBoy trailer DVD--incidentally, if you go to
Best Buy and pick up one of the free DVD's, you are free to sell it
under the first sale doctrine, if you could find someone dumb enough
to buy it, when you got it for lawfully for free), and again, if
that's a lawful copy you may sell it if you wish. Note that this does
not mean you could download a trailer from a movie site, burn it onto
DVD’s and sell them—-the license grant at the site forbids that use.
See, e.g., http://www.sonypictures.com/corp/tos.html (which is a link
from the HellBoy trailer site at http://www.sonypictures.com/movies/hellboy/).




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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 17:50 #17967

  • JMovies
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Nowhere does that say it is illegal to own a print... just that it is illegal to show one without obtaining a license, I am VERY familiar with the law on this sir.

Sir,

I am telling YOU that YOU are wrong, no one else here. Yes, you are fortunate enough to have the resources to own a theatre I know of MANY MANY theatre owners with NO experience before they bought their theatres. Working for yourself and having to be judged by you only on your standards is one thing. Working for others and being judged by THEM on THEIR standards is quite another. You are always going to be your employee of the month in your mind. My friend ran some of the busiest theatres in the circuit he worked for and always had impecable performance reviews, as well as working as a service technician on large territories of theatres with every peice of equipment ever made, and doing that very well. Now he works for the studio I work for in a technical capacity. I reccomended him the job and he has done fantastic by EVERYONES standards. As I have stated I am a lead counsel for a major motion picture studio who would like to own a theatre some day when I retire unfortunately I make too much now to take the paycut to do that right now. So yes we do not own theatres but what does owning a theatre in itself mean? THAT YOU HAD THE FINANCIAL BACKING TO OWN ONE and thats all. I have never been to your theatre so I do not know how well or not it is operated.

[This message has been edited by JMovies (edited March 20, 2008).]
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Re: Raiders of the Lost Ark fundraiser 20 Mar 2008 17:53 #17968

  • slapintheface
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there are 2 recent legal comments ..not my words.... I AM SURE WE ARE STILL WRONG IN THERE EYES...............
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