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TOPIC: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace

Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 18 Jan 2011 23:06 #35157

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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 19 Jan 2011 05:28 #35159

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An art-house with 3d? I do not recall any talk of the need for an art house theater to have 3d. Or even a hybrid. Plus the costs of that system are very well spelled out.
Last Edit: 19 Jan 2011 05:46 by rufusjack.
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eith or it does not make a huge difference to my t 19 Jan 2011 14:03 #35160

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We had Tangled, Toy Story, Shrek 85, Green Hornet, Tron, etc. etc. The only 3-D movie anyone has ever cared about the 3-D to the point it made or broke the decision of where to see it is Avatar. And we still packed em in in 2-D. All the 3-D hype does not seem to turn my customers into people willing to drive 50 miles to get it and not very impressed when they do. Compare that to the reaction if we don't get a certain movie. Good customers will drive out of town in a heart beat if you do not have the movie they want. That isn't happening with 3-D. I think the up charge will disappear in the end.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 20 Jan 2011 05:33 #35162

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DECATUR, IL — The management of the Avon Theater has decided that 3D just is not a good fit for this theater. The high costs coupled with the preferences of the theater’s core audience were preventing the Avon’s investment in a Technicolor 3D system from paying off. The theater, unlike most others, did not charge a premium for 3D presentations.

"I sold the cameras back and told them ‘this is more trouble than it’s worth,’” the longtime theater opera-tor said. “I do regret that we ever did it. The Avon is really not the kind of place for 3D movies. The clientele is not the kind of audience for the movies that are usually released in 3D.”
Huston credited the theater’s “art-house roots” and “upscale commercial crowd” with making it a less than ideal venue to screen bombastic 3D blockbusters like “Clash of the Titans” or “Cats and Dogs: The Revenge of Kitty Galore,” two films the theater took significant losses on due to underwhelming crowd response.

The full story appeared in the Herald-Review.





YOUR COMMENTS

I sincerely hope this is a first step in finally burying this bullsh*t 3D craze once and for all!
posted by Eric F. (www.mymoviesmywords.blogspot.com) on Jan 18, 2011 at 8:40am
Most movie studios are just filming in 2-D to save money and doing a bad convergance to 3-D. The theatre owners love to charge the extra $ for the 3-D hype when It is not true 3-D. When word gets out on these films the public will just go see the movie in 2-D and save the money. 3-D will be dead in a year. The movie companies never learn their lesson from 1953. To film a good movie with two cameras in 3-D done correct can look great but this phony digital 2-D to 3-D one projector 3-D system that is now out is bad news! Goodbye 3-D let's bring 70mm back on large screens on select fims.
posted by Terry Wade on Jan 18, 2011 at 9:10am
Most movie studios are just filming in 2-D to save money and doing a bad convergance to 3-D. The theatre owners love to charge the extra $ for the 3-D hype when It is not true 3-D. When word gets out on these films the public will just go see the movie in 2-D and save the money. 3-D will be dead in a year. The movie companies never learn their lesson from 1953. To film a good movie with two cameras in 3-D done correct can look great but this phony digital 2-D to 3-D one projector 3-D system that is now out is bad news! Goodbye 3-D let's bring 70mm back on large screens on select fims.
posted by Terry Wade on Jan 18, 2011 at 9:11am
Well what does one expect when one doesn't charge a premium on 3D.

I've never been to Decatur, so don't know the area. Maybe folks there just aren't into "event" films. I don't know.

But I like 3D. If cinemas are going to survive, most of them need to add the "thrill" factor you can't get at home.

70mm is great but it doesn't "put you in the picture."
posted by Kirk J. Besse on Jan 18, 2011 at 9:26am
I agree with Terry, we need to bring back 70mm. 3D just needs to die and stay dead. I heard there is a method of film projection that is forty eight frames per second that looks marvelous, even better than regular 35mm film projection. I believe Ebert wrote about it and said it was the best projection he has ever seen. I would rather see that come around to theatres instead of 3D and DLP.
posted by laserdiscfan on Jan 18, 2011 at 9:30am
If patrons are shunning 3D without a premium being charged for it, why would they find it more attractive at premium prices? What is the point of being "in the picture" if it is a picture you do not want to be in?

Hollywood is, as many many of us predicted, repeating history with regard to 3D - using it on inferior movies where it adds little or nothing. There have been other reports of the 2D presentations of films at multiplexes where the film is also playing on 3D where the 2D outsells the 3D version especially when it is a movie aimed at kids.

I agree: if I can't have Cinerama back (the ultimate immersive experience to-date), at least give me 70mm.
posted by CWalczak on Jan 18, 2011 at 10:20am
Its no wonder the theater loss money. They didn't charge the usual premium and they booked the wrong films. Don't recall many raves about "The Revenge of Kitty Galore." If they had booked and rode the Avatar wave, they probably would have done much better. As with any film and 3D versions, there are always going to be good and bad ones.

As far as the faster projection format, that has been around for a few years. Supposedly, the costs of that format is far less then digital, which seems to become outdated as newer, higher resolution projectors become available.

In any case, we're just going in circles with the 70mm vs digital format debate. Everyone laments over the disappearance of 70mm but unless you have trained caring projectionists handling and exhibitors that care about presentation, it'll never ever come back. Today, it is push button automation that rules so that your megaplex makes the buck to keep the investor happy.
posted by JodarMovieFan on Jan 18, 2011 at 10:59am
Good move.A good well written film does not need gadgets,but we know the majority of moviegoers are 14 to 24 years old.
posted by MikeRogers on Jan 18, 2011 at 11:23am
Kirk, why would you really want to be "put in the picture"??? The whole point of a good film is to WATCH and experience it from a viewer's perspective. To "be in it" might as well be real life, and it's just that - real life - that many try to get away from with a good story on the screen.

STUPID GIMICS DO NOT MAKE BETTER FILMS!
posted by Eric F. (www.mymoviesmywords.blogspot.com) on Jan 18, 2011 at 11:50am
I agree, Eric F. 3D was clearly just a short-lived fad that lost its popularity almost as soon as it came in. Good for the theatre operators/managers for doing what they felt was the right thing, considering their audiences.
posted by MPol on Jan 19, 2011 at 4:54am
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 23 May 2011 21:57 #36170

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Analyst: 'Pirates' Was Hurt By 3D As Consumers Tire Of High Ticket Prices
By DAVID LIEBERMAN, Executive Editor | Monday May 23, 2011 @ 2:13pm PDT
Tags: 3D, How to Train Your Dragon, IMAX, James Cameron, Jeff Katzenberg, Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides, Shrek Forever After
Analyst Richard Greenfield of Wall Street's BTIG has long been skeptical of claims by Jeffrey Katzenberg and James Cameron that 3D would do wonders for the movie business. But now Greenfield says that 3D is actually hurting the industry: "U.S. consumers are increasingly rejecting 3D movies," he said in a report today. Attendance for Disney's Pirates of Caribbean: On Stranger Tides "would have been higher" this past weekend if half of its screens showed the movie in conventional 2D instead of just a third, he says. The evidence? He notes that about 38% of the $90 million in box-office revenue for the film's opening weekend came from non-IMAX 3D screens. That's much lower than the average last year, when 54% of the opening revenues for DreamWorks Animation's Shrek Forever After, and 57% of the initial sales for the studio's How To Train Your Dragon, came from non-IMAX 3D screens. Greenfield says that "pricing remains our single biggest concern, especially with so many 3D movies aimed at the family segment." He figures theaters charged $14.85 a ticket to see Pirates on IMAX 3D, $10.85 for non-IMAX 3D, and $7.60 for 2D. He adds that family films also are hurt by "young children not wanted to wear 3D glasses." His advice: Hollywood should make fewer 3D films in 2012. "Focus on making consumer-desirable films rather than worrying about the technology," he says.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 24 May 2011 01:29 #36171

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Yeah, some studios have been greedy with the 3 D movies. Not every movie should be 3 D, but it is still special for the right movie.
3 D on the big screen is going to still separate the out of home movie experience from home video.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 24 May 2011 03:39 #36177

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And, consumers are discerning. After they've seen several films in 3D they now know what "needs" it and what doesn't. Avatar is a completely different movie in 3D. Pirates isn't. Consumers get it. Now the studios will get it too as they see that it can't just be willy-nilly on every movie.

3D isn't dead. It will still work and on certain movies you will have to have it or your sales will be down.

-Elin TW
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 24 May 2011 19:19 #36189

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The American Consumer is Rejecting 3D: Will Hollywood Listen to Consumers vs. Forcing 3D on Us?
Posted on Mon, May 23rd, 2011 at 12:49 pm
by Richard Greenfield —

Despite the cheerleading of RealD’s Michael Lewis, DreamWorks Animation’s Jeffrey Katzenberg and Lightstorm Entertainment’s James Cameron, US consumers are increasingly rejecting 3D movies. In early-mid 2010, the movie industry talked about how the biggest issue holding back 3D box office was screen count - meaning there was demand to see movies in 3D, but too few screens that had been upgraded to 3D. In the past year, 3D screen count has more than doubled from over 4,000 to north of 8,500, in turn, 3D screen availability is no longer a problem/constraint.

Pirates 4’s 3D Box Office Below Shrek 4, Despite Total Box Office $20 Million Higher. Despite exhibitors rolling out as many 3D screens as they possible can, utilizing the RealD financing vehicle in the US, 3D share of box office has started to decline. So if the exhibitors goal is to fill-seats (to sell ultra high margin popcorn), pushing 3D screens is starting to work against them.

As shown in the first exhibit embedded below, non-IMAX 3D percentage of attendance has declined since last year, despite an aggressive 3D screen rollout. When How to Train Your Dragon and Shrek Forever After came out a year-ago, 2D attendance per screen was half of non-IMAX 3D attendance per screen. Fast-forward a year later and you can see 2D attendance per screen exceeding non-IMAX 3D for Thor (see our 5/9 blog post, click here) and nearly doubling non-IMAX 3D for Pirates of the Caribbean 4 this past weekend. We suspect, if exhibitors had allocated more of Pirates 8,000+ screens to 2D overall attendance would have been higher (more than half the screens were 3D, whereas it probably should have been 1/3 at best).

Non-IMAX 3D box office for Pirates was only $34 mm, or 38% of its opening $90 mm (compared to Shrek 4 at about $38 mm, which was 54% of its opening weekend box office with 500 fewer 3D screens).
To make matters worse, Pirates (and Thor) is the type of movie that is supposed to outperform in 3D given the “fanboy” demo focus, compared to the animated/family segment were 3D is burdened by young children not wanting to wear 3D glasses.
The second exhibit embedded below shows the 2009-2011 3D openings by film.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 30 May 2011 13:44 #36337

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May 29, 2011
3-D Starts to Fizzle, and Hollywood Frets

By BROOKS BARNES and MICHAEL CIEPLY

LOS ANGELES — Has the 3-D boom already gone bust? It’s starting to look that way — at least for American moviegoers — even as Hollywood prepares to release a glut of the gimmicky pictures.

Ripples of fear spread across Hollywood last week after “Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides,” which cost Walt Disney Studios an estimated $400 million to make and market, did poor 3-D business in North America. While event movies have typically done 60 percent of their business in 3-D, “Stranger Tides” sold just 47 percent in 3-D. “The American consumer is rejecting 3-D,” Richard Greenfield, an analyst at the financial services company BTIG, wrote of the “Stranger Tides” results.

One movie does not make a trend, but the Memorial Day weekend did not give studio chiefs much comfort in the 3-D department. “Kung Fu Panda 2,” a Paramount Pictures release of a DreamWorks Animation film, sold $53.8 million in tickets from Thursday to Sunday, a soft total, and 3-D was 45 percent of the business, according to Paramount.

Consumer rebellion over high 3-D ticket prices plays a role, and the novelty of putting on the funny glasses is wearing off, analysts say. But there is also a deeper problem: 3-D has provided an enormous boost to the strongest films, including “Avatar” and “Alice in Wonderland,” but has actually undercut middling movies that are trying to milk the format for extra dollars.

“Audiences are very smart,” said Greg Foster, the president of Imax Filmed Entertainment. “When they smell something aspiring to be more than it is, they catch on very quickly.”

Muddying the picture is a contrast between the performance of 3-D movies in North America and overseas. If results are troubling domestically, they are the exact opposite internationally, where the genre is a far newer phenomenon. Indeed, 3-D screenings powered “Stranger Tides” to about $256 million on its first weekend abroad; Disney trumpeted the figure as the biggest international debut of all time.

With results like that at a time when movies make 70 percent of their total box office income outside North America, do tastes at home even matter?

After a disappointing first half of the year, Hollywood is counting on a parade of 3-D films to dig itself out of a hole. From May to September, the typical summer season, studios will unleash 16 movies in the format, more than double the number last year. Among the most anticipated releases are “Transformers: Dark of the Moon,” due from Paramount on July 1, and Part 2 of Part 7 of the “Harry Potter” series, arriving two weeks later from Warner Brothers.

The need is urgent. The box-office performance in the first six months of 2011 was soft — revenue fell about 9 percent compared with last year, while attendance was down 10 percent — and that comes amid decay in home-entertainment sales. In all formats, including paid streaming and DVDs, home entertainment revenue fell almost 10 percent, according to the Digital Entertainment Group.

The first part of the year held a near collapse in video store rentals, which fell 36 percent to about $440 million, offsetting gains from cut-price rental kiosks and subscriptions. In addition, the sale of packaged discs fell about 20 percent, to about $2.2 billion, while video-on-demand, though growing, delivered total sales of less than a quarter of that amount.

At the box office, animated films, which have recently been Hollywood’s most reliable genre, have fallen into a deep trough, as the category’s top three performers combined — “Rio,” from Fox; “Rango,” from Paramount; and “Hop,” from Universal — have had fewer ticket buyers than did “Shrek the Third,” from DreamWorks Animation, after its release in mid-May four years ago.

“Kung Fu Panda 2” appears poised to become the biggest animated hit of the year so far; but it would have to stretch well past its own predecessor to beat “Shrek Forever After,” another May release, which took in $238.7 million last year.

For the weekend, “The Hangover: Part II” sold $118 million from Thursday to Sunday, easily enough for No. 1. “Kung Fu Panda 2” was second. Disney’s “Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides” was third with $39.3 million for a new total of $152.9 million. “Bridesmaids” (Universal Pictures) was fourth with $16.4 million for a new total of about $85 million. “Thor” (Marvel Studios) rounded out the top five with $9.4 million for a new total of $160 million.

Studio chiefs acknowledge that the industry needs to sort out its 3-D strategy. Despite the soft results for “Kung Fu Panda 2,” animated releases have continued to perform well in the format, overcoming early problems with glasses that didn’t fit little faces. But general-audience movies like “Stranger Tides” may be better off the old-fashioned way.

“With a blockbuster-filled holiday weekend skewing heavily toward 2-D, and 3-D ticket sales dramatically underperforming relative to screen allocation, major studios will hopefully begin to rethink their 3-D rollout plans for the rest of the year and 2012,” Mr. Greenfield said on Friday.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 30 May 2011 19:43 #36339

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Here's the bottom-line

3D conversions can now be done in China for around 8,000.USA based conversion houses charge around 300,000 per film. Speilberg,Katzenberg and Lucas have all declared that 3D is going to be around for awhile. HBO has sent out bids to convert its entire library into 3D.


I am not a fan but its not going away.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 31 May 2011 02:11 #36340

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I might be off by a few months -- but first what will stop is the surcharge and then 3d will be few and far between.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 31 May 2011 02:51 #36342

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The issue at the core of everything is whether the studio still consider a theatrical release viable. We are seeing too many films go straight to the ancilliary markets vod, dvd etc. What the studios are attempting to do is aggregate greater earnings in fewer pictures. A 300,000 investment in CLASH OF THE TITANS might prove to be sound. I personally think that the release windows shortening is what the theatre owners should look at, as well as the rise of 5 foot wide screens in the home. Plans are being made to stream 2K and 4K images directly into the home via the Akamai network and smart enabled TV's.

The theatrical industry had better become aware of the true intentions of the studios and adjust their business model towards combating it. Fox, just announced the slow death of 35mm. There will be a theatrical experience in studios have their way, but it will be in the home. And they will not have to share the box office with anyone. Remember the cost of delivery digital for a feature film into the home is about .09....
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 31 May 2011 15:22 #36352

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it is something to ponder... and we all are.. the panel-Cameron, Katzenberg, Lucas that I listened to in Vegas do not seem to share the negative thoughts. They're the artists. So I think they'll keep making 3-D until there's a genuine revolution on the part of moviegoers and exhibitors. To some degree I think that push back is happening.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 31 May 2011 15:24 #36353

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BTIG Research
3Disaster: American Families Just Say No to 3D…When Will the Novelty of 3D Wear Off Overseas?
Posted on Tue, May 31st, 2011 at 7:56 am
by Richard Greenfield —

While this past weekend’s box office was up dramatically year-over-year, the strength of 2D-only Hangover 2 obscured the disappointing 3D box office from Kung Fu Panda 2, Pirates 4 and Thor. Early sales data Friday (see our 5/27 blog post, click here) made it clear that DWA’s Kung Fu Panda 2 would sell more 2D tickets than 3D tickets, however, the final tally was even worse than we imagined, with only 45% of box office coming from 3D and only 36% of attendees coming from 3D presentations (45% is the lowest 3D box office share since Despicable Me last summer, which had significantly fewer 3D screens than KFP2).

The table at the bottom of this blog shows 3D movie openings over the past three years updated for this past weekend’s KFP2 release.

While exhibitors continue to allocate more and more screens to 3D, the American consumer is increasingly opting for 2D (see our 5/23 blog, click here). As shown in the first Exhibit embedded below, exhibitors played Kung Fu Panda 2 on more 3D screens than 2D screens, yet attendance per screen was nearly twice as heavy in 2D auditoriums than 3D auditoriums.
• Exhibitors are simply not listening to their customers. 3D is priced too high and even more importantly, consumers are simply tiring of seeing movies in 3D. Exhibitors need to begin reducing the 3D screen count for movies that do not really need 3D (Transformers is probably the one major exception this summer).
• Not only was KFP2’s 3D percentage disappointing, but according to Boxofficeguru (click here), Pirates’ 3D box office fell week-to-week from 46% to 44% and even Thor is down to 41% (albeit Thor may be suffering from 3D screen loss after the last two movies were allocated way too many 3D screens).
• Read the comments section of recent 3D articles on the web to get a sense of what consumers are saying about 3D technology and pricing: click here for NYTimes, click here for Deadline.com and click here for Entertainment Weekly.
• While studios may continue to say that they are still making more money from 3D than if they made 2D only movies, they are missing the point of how they are upsetting the delicate price/value equation of movie-going.

How Long Will the International “Crutch” Last? The 3D “believers” acknowledge that 3D demand is falling in the US, but talk about how it does not really matter because of the strength of 3D outside the US. While we acknowledge that 3D has been incredibly strong outside the US, it is also “fresher” / “newer.” In the early days of the current 3D wave in the US, even bad movies were doing very strong 3D business, however, as the consumer was bombarded week after week with 3D movies (esp “bad” 3D movies), interest began to fade, especially with a meaningful 3D ticket upcharge (hovers around $3.25).
• We suspect 3D demand will slow over the coming year overseas as the “novelty” begins to wear off.
• Important to remember that weaker domestic box office has an “overweight” impact on profits as ancillary revenues/profits are principally driven by domestic box office.
How Long Will the International “Crutch” Last? The 3D “believers” acknowledge that 3D demand is falling in the US, but talk about how it does not really matter because of the strength of 3D outside the US. While we acknowledge that 3D has been incredibly strong outside the US, it is also “fresher” / “newer.” In the early days of the current 3D wave in the US, even bad movies were doing very strong 3D business, however, as the consumer was bombarded week after week with 3D movies (esp “bad” 3D movies), interest began to fade, especially with a meaningful 3D ticket upcharge (hovers around $3.25).
• We suspect 3D demand will slow over the coming year overseas as the “novelty” begins to wear off.
• Important to remember that weaker domestic box office has an “overweight” impact on profits as ancillary revenues/profits are principally driven by domestic box office.









Read more: www.btigresearch.com/2011/05/31/3disaste...-12787#ixzz1NwUon59T


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Last Edit: 31 May 2011 15:25 by Mike.
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Re: 3d ---12/31/2011--- rest in peace 31 May 2011 17:20 #36358

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I think it is a little premature to call 3-D dead. We are only a couple years into a new technology and how filmmakers use the tool will decide if it says or goes. Jurrasic Park came out and everyone rushed to convert to digital sound and for the next few years it was a mess. Many film makers just dropped sound into the movie to show off the new toy. Eventually filmmakers used the toy to help tell the story and technology became a required part of the experience. If filmmakers learn how to make 3-D help tell the story then it stays. If not then it is the fade many of you are predicting.
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